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Author Topic: Whoever's Whatever (Update 6-8)  (Read 4386 times)
Whoever
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« on: Feb 18, 2007 12:36 am »

First off, I've been here a little while now, and was starting to feel kind of sheepish about still not having posted any fanart, especially being an art student and all that. Anyways, this is my first "real" bit of Avatar fanart, so feel free to offer any criticism you've got, I'll gladly take it (hopefully this will get more attention than the writing piece linked in my sig, heh heh).

Second, if you want to ask me about where on earth I got this idea, don't bother, because I have no idea whatsoever.



As you can see, I tried using the same pen and ink medium I used for my "self-portrait" in the corresponding thread in The Courtyard: I found it more difficult to use here, since it's often easier to lose facial features and such on "cartoony" figures than it is on more complex and "realistic" ones, and I had to emphasize some of the more "important" lines to make sure they came through at least decently. I think the overall "point" came across, but I'll need outside viewers to confirm/deny that...depending on how this is received, I'll have to see how other characters might look in the same medium.

Also, as I said, I'm pretty inexperienced drawing the Avatar characters...Iroh's pretty easy to identify to begin with, so he wasn't too much of a problem as far as that's concerned (though he did end up looking taller than usual, since I tried to mimic the scrawny old farmer from "American Gothic," probably a bit too much), but Zuko looks a ways "off" to me...I can't put my finger on exactly what it is, though, so someone else can hopefully help me with that...along with anything else they might notice that I missed.

Lastly, just to be safe, I figured I'd better post a link to the original version of the song Iroh's singing, since not everyone here is an old fart like me, heh heh.

Hope you enjoy. Smiley
« Last Edit: Jun 08, 2007 10:24 pm by Whoever » Logged


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« Reply #1 on: Feb 18, 2007 12:41 am »

Hehe.  That's cute.   I love Zuko's expression for he looks slightly constipated.

  I think you actually would've been better without the pen shading on top of the figures.  The background it fits but on the figures themselves it feels like it spoils it.  Keep drawing though.  You got somethin' here.
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« Reply #2 on: Feb 18, 2007 02:30 am »

I've always been fond of etched illustrations, which your cross-hatching style is so reminiscent of.  Smiley

My attempt at constructive criticism:
In my opinion you could take it even a bit further, and darken the shading (under Iroh's beard, on the right side of his limbs, etc) to give more contrast and a stronger sense of depth. And you could darken the pitch-fork, to make it stand out more.

Where I agree with FMI, is that on the faces and hands, you could have used fewer (or no) cross-lines.

I hope I'm not sounding negative - I really like your style of drawing, (and I appreciate that it's a particularly tricky style to pull of) and I hope you post more! (is Irovagabor a new ship now?)
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« Reply #3 on: Feb 18, 2007 09:57 am »

Ooooooooh, I don't recall seeing any of your work before Cheesy.

This is really brilliant Smiley.  I love the style and the concept!  "Come on Zuko, you know the words!" really sounds like something Iroh would say Tongue.  Hehe- the things us Avatards do to the characters in Avatar....I just find it so fascinating how we do things to them based on our own personal quirks and interests, and the Green Acres theme is an excellent example of that Smiley.
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« Reply #4 on: Feb 18, 2007 10:43 am »

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I love Zuko's expression for he looks slightly constipated.
Heh heh, yeah, indeed he does. In any event, I was quite determined to, let's say, make his thoughts on his situation readily evident. Wink I'm still trying to figure out why he doesn't look quite right (aside from the expression) though...

Quote
In my opinion you could take it even a bit further, and darken the shading (under Iroh's beard, on the right side of his limbs, etc) to give more contrast and a stronger sense of depth. And you could darken the pitch-fork, to make it stand out more.Where I agree with FMI, is that on the faces and hands, you could have used fewer (or no) cross-lines.
What you say about the pitchfork, etc. makes sense, but I find the stuff about the faces a bit tricky to envision: somehow it would look weird to me if I cross-hatched all over the place and just left the faces untouched...as it is I used fewer lines on them than I did elsewhere, and as a result they look a little "rougher" than the rest. Hmm...perhaps I ought to just stick with more "traditional" means of coloring/shading if I cook up anything else like this, and keep things simple.

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I hope I'm not sounding negative
Not at all, and I said I was looking for some con-crit anyways. Smiley "Irovagabor," eh? Hee hee, you know what, I could honestly envision that one. Grin

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Hehe- the things us Avatards do to the characters in Avatar....I just find it so fascinating how we do things to them based on our own personal quirks and interests...
"Quirk" doesn't begin to describe it. Grin

Thanks for the response so far! Smiley
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« Reply #5 on: Feb 21, 2007 04:22 pm »

Here's my first-ever entry to the "Illustrate the Quote" thread...



This time I tried to compensate for ink lines with grayscale markers, though methinks I probably still ended up cross-hatching more than I should have. Anyways, as before, let me know what you think.
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« Reply #6 on: Feb 21, 2007 05:48 pm »

Hehe, that's funny !  "rotting so sloooooow" Tongue

The art itself is great!  Might actually prefer it to the first one you posted.  I think those markers and your ink lines make a wonderful combination!  Don't think you need to do anymore cross-hatching on this one Smiley
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« Reply #7 on: Feb 21, 2007 06:35 pm »

Haha, excellent work Whoever, I was wondering when you were going to post some art when I saw your awesome self portrait.

Kay, constructive crits AWAAYYYY---

Lesee, for starters I love Zuko and Irohs expressions. Zukos especially, because it pretty much defines Zuko's entire identity of whiney, angry boy, and juxtaposed with Iroh's carefree grin just makes it all the more hilarious. Cheesy I also like the idea of "American Gothic" Zuko and Iroh a perfect parody I must say. The proportions are sound other than, as you pointed out, Iroh grew a bit and slimmed down Wink and I think the main thing that is making Zuko look "off" is his face shape, you have it in a fairly square type shape while Zuko has a longer face shape, if you look at the screen shots (most noteably those from Cave of two lovers cause he has no hair to distract from his face shape) his cheekbones are high and his face is longer and more angular.

As far as the cross hatching goes, the checkerboard hatches on Zuko and Iroh's faces only function to flatten the picture and are really unnecessary. As far as help on crosshatching 'cartoony' figures, I saw a pretty neat pic a while back that I immediately thought of http://www.closet-space.com/Art/full%20images/businesswoman.htm that might be a good reference of sorts Smiley

On the second pic, I like the graytones and absolutely love Iroh's song haha, pretty awesome stuff!

Anyway, can't wait to see more of your stuff and where your style takes you, I like where you're going with the cross hatching, probably because I don't see it much which is a shame cause cross hatching looks pretty cool. I also like the grayscale markers good stuff, good stuff.

So yeah, hope I didn't type your internet ears off, and I commend you for making it this far through my incessant rambling Smiley
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« Reply #8 on: Feb 21, 2007 09:15 pm »

I think the main thing that is making Zuko look "off" is his face shape, you have it in a fairly square type shape while Zuko has a longer face shape, if you look at the screen shots (most noteably those from Cave of two lovers cause he has no hair to distract from his face shape) his cheekbones are high and his face is longer and more angular.
Hmm. Thanks, I'll keep an eye out for those things in particular when/if I toss up another drawing of him.

Quote
As far as the cross hatching goes, the checkerboard hatches on Zuko and Iroh's faces only function to flatten the picture and are really unnecessary.
Yeah, you're probably right here. To get a sense of shape going via any sort of line technique I'd need to really get in there and curve each line individually...on some larger-scale (non-Avatar, obviously) pieces I've done this (maybe I should post them somewhere?...they're pretty disturbing), but on a regular ol' 8.5x11 paper for a piece o' cheesy fanart I don't know if I've got it in me, heh heh. I'll probably stick to the markers, or maybe do something in color.

Quote
As far as help on crosshatching 'cartoony' figures, I saw a pretty neat pic a while back that I immediately thought of http://www.closet-space.com/Art/full%20images/businesswoman.htm that might be a good reference of sorts Smiley
That's really cool, and right up my alley (more or less the sort of skill in this area that I wish I had, heh heh), thanks much for the link. The guy says he did the thinner stuff with a technical pen...I really do need to get myself another one of those (my last one, er, met an unfortunate demise some time back), since even my current "micro" tip pens aren't suited for that sort of detail work. Come to think of it I'll bet my markers aren't stinky enough either.

Quote
On the second pic, I like the graytones and absolutely love Iroh's song haha, pretty awesome stuff!
Hee hee, I was debating whether or not to put "the song" in there, seeing as my sense of, er, "humor" is very, um, "different" (read: retarded) from most other people's...so far it seems to be getting at least a decent reception though, so I guess in this case my gamble (hopefully) paid off. Wink

Quote
So yeah, hope I didn't type your internet ears off, and I commend you for making it this far through my incessant rambling Smiley
Are you kidding? Artistic advice from The Mighty Dinglehopper (tm) is like the proverbial climb to see the guru at the top of the mountain, except I don't actually have to do any climbing (good thing too, 'cuz I'm too lazy to actually do anything like that in the first place, however badly I might need to).

Thanks much for taking the time to look and post, both of you! Smiley
« Last Edit: Feb 21, 2007 09:18 pm by Whoever » Logged


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« Reply #9 on: Mar 21, 2007 06:17 pm »

Guess I can't really call this thread "Silly Pen and Ink Sketch" anymore since I'm posting something in pencil now...anyways, this is a drawing I did while the class I'm student teaching was taking some standardized tests. It depicts a scene I've semi-imagined for a fanfic I'm considering writing, the possible prologue for which is linked in my sig. I'm not going to bother trying to explain who it is or what's going on, as I haven't even thought it through completely yet...I've even considered nixing said scene altogether. This was basically created to kill some time, but I figured I might as well display it anyway.



Just regular ol' number 2 pencil on the back of a printout...I actually had to crop out the 3-hole punch area and a few other things. :X Anyways, obviously all the technical stuff is off, since I had no visual references handy, but constructive criticism, as always, is still plenty welcome. I might redo this in pen and ink eventually, but who knows.
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« Reply #10 on: Mar 22, 2007 02:34 pm »

I think the first one has a funny concept, is drawn well, but the cross-hatching has kind of ruined it. Cross-hatching can be a powerful tool, as displayed in Dinglehopper's link, but it takes skill and practice to wield it.

Cross-hatching is easier when the drawing has thicker outlines than the actual cross-hatching, this will help separate the drawing from the cross-hatching instead of the cross-hatching becoming the drawing. Of course, you can go for a more realistic approach and use one thickness, but it's also incredibly difficult. It's also essential, in my opinion, to use cross-hatching as a way to define volume. By curving the lines with the shape of the object, the cross-hatching illustrates both shade and volume. Cross-hatching also works in the same way as resolution does in an digital image: the smaller, the better. Having very thin and many lines in your cross-hatching will increase the level of detail.
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« Reply #11 on: Mar 22, 2007 03:23 pm »

Heh, yeah, I'm still working on that. I did get myself a thinner pen than I'd been using recently, so I'll have to take it on a test drive one of these days...I was sort of able to "scale down" the lines as you described in the pencil piece, but the impact's not quite the same, especially seeing as it got a bit smudged in the process. I also lost a lot of the background when I tried to get the darkness of the scene (sans candle) in there, and it's not the first time I've done so either.
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« Reply #12 on: Apr 13, 2007 07:03 pm »

Hey, pretty good work Whoever. The crosshatching's a little weird, but it's pretty darn good art. And in the first pic, Zuko's face looks like Naruto (In a good way)
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« Reply #13 on: Apr 13, 2007 08:56 pm »

wow i love your art!! your talented
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« Reply #14 on: Apr 13, 2007 09:07 pm »

The thread, it lives, it liiives!

The crosshatching's a little weird
Heh, guess is sort of suits me. Wink

Quote
And in the first pic, Zuko's face looks like Naruto (In a good way)
Heh heh, now that you mention it, I can see that. Nowhere near my intention, of course, but there it is. Grin

Thanks for the compliments! Smiley
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« Reply #15 on: Apr 13, 2007 09:12 pm »

You're welcome. First request! I challenge you to draw Aang and Sokka as Eminem and Dr. Dre
If you can do that, I will worship you (not just because I like the rappers, but because that would be the single greatest drawing in the world). You don't have to, but you haven't posted a piece of art in a while, so I don't know if you can't think of anything.
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« Reply #16 on: Jun 08, 2007 10:30 pm »

...

...okay, where to begin?

Helio, I have no idea if you remember this or are even still around, but Scout's honor, I honest to goodness had not checked this thread in nearly two months, and had no idea that someone had made a request for me (as you could probably tell, it doesn't happen often)...as such, I apologize if it seemed like I was ignoring you or otherwise didn't care. However, I have attempted to atone for my sins, as follows.

I suppose I ought to offer a disclaimer: I do not exaggerate when I say that few people know less about rap than I do. Regardless, armed with a bunch of pens and markers, a handful of Google searches, and a whole lot of stereotypes and guesswork, I proceeded to toss all of the aforementioned into the proverbial blender, and this is what came out.



And there you have it, Sokka Dre and Aanginem. As you can tell, the background was something of an afterthought...I considered attempting to toss something about "Deez Leechi Nuuuts" in there, but thought better of it.

In case you're interested, here's a "detail shot" of the piece at full size.



Anyway, I have no idea whether this was anything like what you had in mind, but hopefully it's passable. Guess this is probably why I don't get many requests, heh heh.
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« Reply #17 on: Jun 09, 2007 02:47 am »

Haha!  This is great Cheesy.  I love Sokka's wolf tail coming out behind his cap Cheesy.  Also - much love to how you apply your technique to render Aang's tattoos...definitely gives him a more 'gaansta' look Tongue.  And I find it highly amusing how he not only has an arrow on his foreheard, but also has one on his beanie Cheesy
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« Reply #18 on: Jun 09, 2007 05:23 pm »

Yes, the whole tattoo-through-cross-hatching is quite creative and awesome. Aang looks the best here, with clear cross hatching and the aforementioned arrow effect. Also like his pose.

I'm kinda missing that on Sokka. The pose doesn't look very natural (especially his arms, they seem to be coming out of his chest) and the cross hatching looks very different from Aang's, far more rough. I think you should try and keep up on what you did on Aang's design, because that looks pretty good.

And of course, Sokka plus anything associated with rap equals WIN.
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« Reply #19 on: Jun 09, 2007 09:46 pm »

You are Jesus's third cousin's nephew's uncle's sister's brothers' fifth aunt twice removed's best friend's good friend's cousin's niece's best friend's former roommate's extremely distant relative. What does that mean? You have creates the single greatest drawing in the universe. Could I have the privelige, no! The honor, of using that close-up of Sokka as my Avatar?

Oh, and I actually forgot about that request too. So no hard feelings. Only positively positive ones.
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« Reply #20 on: Jun 09, 2007 10:21 pm »

Quote
And I find it highly amusing how he not only has an arrow on his foreheard, but also has one on his beanie.
Heh, I can't take credit for that one, I've seen others use that gag in their artwork some time before I made this...in the photo of Eminem that I used as a reference he was wearing one of those hats, so I figured I might as well run with it.

Quote
I'm kinda missing that on Sokka. The pose doesn't look very natural (especially his arms, they seem to be coming out of his chest)...
I suppose it's pretty obvious that I had a full-body shot reference for Aang, but not for Sokka...yeah, I knew the arms looked a bit off even as I was doing it, but the more I see 'em now the more mutated Sokka looks. As for the pose, again, I had no reference, so I just tried to think up some sort of pseudo-stereotypical "rapper pose"...did I mention I know squat about rap?

Quote
...and the cross hatching looks very different from Aang's, far more rough.
Funny story, that one...believe it or not, I used the same type of pen to do the crosshatching on both figures. The difference is, the pen I used for Aang was nearly out of ink, and as a result his lines ended up looking more subtle/delicate than Sokka's, whom I used a fuller pen on. I do have a technical pen with an even smaller nib, but it gets clogged at the drop of a hat...in fact, it probably needs cleaning as we speak.

Quote
Could I have the privelige, no! The honor, of using that close-up of Sokka as my Avatar?
I don't know how it'll look when shrunk down to avvy size, but whatever you want to do with the drawing, it's all yours.
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« Reply #21 on: Jun 09, 2007 10:40 pm »

Thank you. You are Moses' brother- you know what? I think you get it.
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« Reply #22 on: Jun 12, 2007 08:17 pm »

ha that's amazing! i love the expression on aangs face! Tongue
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« Reply #23 on: Sep 19, 2007 09:03 pm »

I like the piece with Iroh and Zuko. Maltesse strokes? I can't spell lol
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« Reply #24 on: Sep 19, 2007 09:19 pm »

Holy crap, it LIVES!

Thanks for the comment on the drawing, though I'm not sure exactly what you're referring to there...
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