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Poll
Question: Would you prefer novels as part of the expanded literature of Avatar?
Yes, in conjunction with the comics. - 21 (44.7%)
Yes, replacing the comics. - 10 (21.3%)
No, stick to just the comics. - 8 (17%)
No, only the shows. - 8 (17%)
Total Voters: 47

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Author Topic: Would you prefer novels?  (Read 10992 times)
Avatar Epsilon
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« Reply #75 on: Apr 22, 2014 04:50 pm »

The point I was trying to make is that when it came to Ozai, it was not consensual, which was why Aang had a problem with it killing him. With Zuko it was consensual, which was why Aang decided to make the promise.

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guyw1tn0nam3
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Why are you so salty?


« Reply #76 on: Apr 22, 2014 04:55 pm »

The point I was trying to make is that when it came to Ozai, it was not consensual, which was why Aang had a problem with it killing him. With Zuko it was consensual, which was why Aang decided to make the promise.

Yeaaaaaaa, pretty sure it being consensual has nothing to do with why people are upset. In fact, it may be the reason why people are upset.
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Solid Sun
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« Reply #77 on: Apr 22, 2014 05:33 pm »

I do believe Aang was just confident in Zuko and never thought he would turn out like Ozai.
The whole "I'm okay with killing you" was probably to ease Zuko's mind a bit.
« Last Edit: Apr 22, 2014 06:17 pm by Solid Sun » Logged



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guyw1tn0nam3
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Why are you so salty?


« Reply #78 on: Apr 22, 2014 05:55 pm »

Then, the whole "No ded ozai" is a façade : Aang relish on the bloodshed and wanted to kill Ozai, he was just hiding his true sentiments to look like a hero to the others !
Also, he used spiritbending because he thought it could kill Ozai, when it turned out Ozai was alive, he pulled an explanation out of his rear end.
That's why Aang was so quick to say "yes" when the new fire lord asked him to kill him if he became a monster, Zuko was offering his head on a silver plate and Aang's murder instincts couldn't be calmed down, he needed a victim.
(In fact, the whole "Okay, I'll kill you" is probably because of plot or because Aang was confident in Zuko and thought that he couldn't turn out like Ozai).

What am I reading?
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Loopy
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« Reply #79 on: Apr 22, 2014 06:22 pm »

The start of any reboot or alternative character interpretations is going to have to start by tossing The Promise.

Yeah, I get that part. But why should their be a reboot or anything like that? Why not just expand the universe and write new stories instead of retooling an old one?

What?

Am I the only one who reads comics around here?

Why wouldn't there be a reboot? Continuities reboot every ten years to pick up new readers. They reboot when they switch publishers. They reboot when a new writer is brought in who can't be bothered to read the previous guy's stuff. They reboot because readers can't relate to a main character who has a healthy, functioning marriage. They reboot because other people are doing it and rebooting is cool. And I'm not even talking superheroes, here; I once saw a Transformers continuity reboot because it switched from being published in color to being published in black and white.

That's just a bizarre question.


That's very nice for you, but what did you think "supplementary" was going to mean? The stuff on the website was supplementary to the main story, and now the main story is contradicting it.

Exactly, it was supplementary to the main story, not a story on its own.  The comics are stories on their own.  Contradicting a little side information and contradicting an actual published story really aren't the same thing.  The former does not set a precedent for the latter.

Eh, my experience in the Star Wars fandom says differently.
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Solid Sun
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« Reply #80 on: Apr 22, 2014 06:37 pm »

Then, the whole "No ded ozai" is a façade : Aang relish on the bloodshed and wanted to kill Ozai, he was just hiding his true sentiments to look like a hero to the others !
Also, he used spiritbending because he thought it could kill Ozai, when it turned out Ozai was alive, he pulled an explanation out of his rear end.
That's why Aang was so quick to say "yes" when the new fire lord asked him to kill him if he became a monster, Zuko was offering his head on a silver plate and Aang's murder instincts couldn't be calmed down, he needed a victim.
(In fact, the whole "Okay, I'll kill you" is probably because of plot or because Aang was confident in Zuko and thought that he couldn't turn out like Ozai).

What am I reading?

*Ninja Edit*
The start of any reboot or alternative character interpretations is going to have to start by tossing The Promise.

Yeah, I get that part. But why should their be a reboot or anything like that? Why not just expand the universe and write new stories instead of retooling an old one?

What?

Am I the only one who reads comics around here?

Why wouldn't there be a reboot? Continuities reboot every ten years to pick up new readers. They reboot when they switch publishers. They reboot when a new writer is brought in who can't be bothered to read the previous guy's stuff. They reboot because readers can't relate to a main character who has a healthy, functioning marriage. They reboot because other people are doing it and rebooting is cool. And I'm not even talking superheroes, here; I once saw a Transformers continuity reboot because it switched from being published in color to being published in black and white.

That's just a bizarre question.


That's very nice for you, but what did you think "supplementary" was going to mean? The stuff on the website was supplementary to the main story, and now the main story is contradicting it.

Exactly, it was supplementary to the main story, not a story on its own.  The comics are stories on their own.  Contradicting a little side information and contradicting an actual published story really aren't the same thing.  The former does not set a precedent for the latter.

Eh, my experience in the Star Wars fandom says differently.

For me, Reboot is rather there when they guys who make the comics got too many ideas that would ruin the current continuity or because fans request a reboot.
Naturally, said fans will be the firsts to spout incoherent ramblings on message boards when the reboot will be announced.
« Last Edit: Apr 22, 2014 06:38 pm by Solid Sun » Logged



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Funkybender
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« Reply #81 on: Apr 22, 2014 07:07 pm »

I'm not in favor of a reboot, but the main problem with The Promise is that Gene's interpretation of the relationship between Aang and Zuko directly contradicts Aang's guiding ethos in ATLA. He spent several episodes seriously distressed at the prospect of having to kill Ozai, and tried to find a way by which he could defeat him without killing him. Within the first few pages of The Promise, Aang has already agreed to end Zuko should he become like his father, with little hesitation. You could say that the connotation of the word "end" is ambiguous, but I think it was clear what Zuko meant. That is very out-of-character.

Little hesitation?  He protests at the suggestion.  It's only thanks to pressure from Zuko and Katara that Aang agrees.  It was always pretty clear to me that it was a promise that Aang never wanted to make.  The prolonged character drama and conflict was saved for Aang deciding whether or not to carry out his promise, not making the promise in the first place.

Right, he does protest. But I was still troubled at how easily Aang accepted the suggestion in comparison to how vehemently against taking the life of Ozai he was. I understand how the implications of this promise factor into their dynamic, but I still don't think Aang is one to agree merely to appease Zuko.

The point I was trying to make is that when it came to Ozai, it was not consensual, which was why Aang had a problem with it killing him. With Zuko it was consensual, which was why Aang decided to make the promise.
Yeaaaaaaa, pretty sure it being consensual has nothing to do with why people are upset. In fact, it may be the reason why people are upset.

Pretty much this. It was an understandably abrupt suggestion on Zuko's part, but Aang let Zuko persuade him much too easily for my liking. I guess I'm basing this on my subjective feelings, but it all happened too quickly for my liking.
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Red Hawk
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« Reply #82 on: Apr 23, 2014 12:23 am »

What?

Am I the only one who reads comics around here?

Why wouldn't there be a reboot? Continuities reboot every ten years to pick up new readers. They reboot when they switch publishers. They reboot when a new writer is brought in who can't be bothered to read the previous guy's stuff. They reboot because readers can't relate to a main character who has a healthy, functioning marriage. They reboot because other people are doing it and rebooting is cool. And I'm not even talking superheroes, here; I once saw a Transformers continuity reboot because it switched from being published in color to being published in black and white.

That's just a bizarre question.

He asked why should there be a reboot.  You answered why wouldn't there be a reboot, which isn't an answer to what he said.  Sure, there's precedent in other franchises for reboots.  That doesn't mean it's the right thing to do for the Avatar franchise.

There are many reasons franchises and continuities get rebooted, but in my opinion there are only a couple good reasons.  One is if the continuity is struggling in popularity, but the brand is still strong.  That way you get reboots like the Nolan Batman films or the Abrams Star Trek films.  The other is if continuity is such a mess that hitting the reset button is honestly the better option over letting things continue on.

Neither reason applies to the Avatar franchise.  Tossing in a One More Day reference isn't helping your case that a reboot would somehow be a good thing.
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Loopy
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« Reply #83 on: Apr 23, 2014 06:47 pm »

Did I say it would be a good thing? Huh

I'd like to see it, personally, because I don't like the direction of the comics, but I was really just talking about how it would be done and what might cause some stories to be overwritten. To me, the "should" is a question I have no interest in seeking an answer to, because that's hardly stopped things from rebooting before. (Or the reverse, really.) Whether Avatar's secondary media will reboot despite any of our preferences is a much more interesting discussion, IMO.

But now I realize we're getting off-topic. If we'd all like to continue this line of discussion, I'm pretty sure there's a "Are the comics canon?" topic somewhere around here.
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Red Hawk
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« Reply #84 on: Apr 23, 2014 07:36 pm »

Did I say it would be a good thing? Huh

I'd like to see it, personally, because I don't like the direction of the comics, but I was really just talking about how it would be done and what might cause some stories to be overwritten. To me, the "should" is a question I have no interest in seeking an answer to, because that's hardly stopped things from rebooting before. (Or the reverse, really.) Whether Avatar's secondary media will reboot despite any of our preferences is a much more interesting discussion, IMO.

But now I realize we're getting off-topic. If we'd all like to continue this line of discussion, I'm pretty sure there's a "Are the comics canon?" topic somewhere around here.

It actually does make for an interesting topic.  But talking about the possibility of an Avatar continuity reboot kind of goes beyond the scope of even an "Are the comics canon" thread, because it would inevitably involve talking about if the main ATLA and LoK cartoons would be replaced by the reboot themselves.
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