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Question: Rate This Episode:
10 - 86 (28.5%)
9 - 54 (17.9%)
8 - 70 (23.2%)
7 - 44 (14.6%)
6 - 16 (5.3%)
5 - 11 (3.6%)
4 - 6 (2%)
3 - 7 (2.3%)
2 - 1 (0.3%)
1 - 7 (2.3%)
Total Voters: 293

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Author Topic: [110] Jet  (Read 31786 times)
Avatar_Mom
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« Reply #25 on: Aug 11, 2006 10:50 am »

I was pretty amazed by her crush on Jet myself. I was disappointed, but I remembered we don't always make the best choices when it comes to "crushes" when we are young. It did show me what kind of boy gets her attention for now.
« Last Edit: Aug 11, 2006 11:10 am by Avatar_Mom » Logged

Opal Koboi
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« Reply #26 on: Aug 11, 2006 03:53 pm »

I find Jet's actions unjustifiable at any time, and I'm very glad the makers of Avatar and (apparently) most of the viewing public agree.
I would have to disagree with this contention.  I think Jet's actions were perfectly logical and justifiable when you look at it from a combat perspective.  They are facing an asymmetrical force.  Jet's group simply can't take on the Fire Nation forces in their valley in straightforward combat.  This means they have two primary methods of attacking the Fire Nation.  The first is guerilla warfare and the second is terrorism.

Their goal is to drive the Fire Nation out of the valley.  Wiping out a village full of Fire Nation citizens would be conducive to this goal.  What they were trying to do was to make the effort and cost to hold on the valley too great for the Fire Nation to bear.  Any suffering and death that is caused that leads to this aim would be considered acceptable.

While I do not condone nor support their actions, I can understand why they tried to do what they did.  Were I in similar straits I would probably consider such extreme measures as well.

You would consider drowning children as a viable means to obtaining your goals? Apart for the appaling moral issues, when and where has this strategy actually produced a good and desirable outcome?
(desirable to either side of the conflict). Jet may have wiped one company, or one regiment of fire nation soldiers, along with the innocent civilians of the town. Big deal. By next month, the firenation would have sent in a new contingent.
In my (never to be humbled) opinion, Such actions are motivated by a blind desire for revenge, not an honest attempt to improve anyone's future.
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climbtreez
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« Reply #27 on: Aug 13, 2006 07:27 am »

I liked this episode a lot. It kind of seemed to be filler though. Not much plot development. It was a nice break none the less from the normal episodes. I thought it was very intresting to see Katara go gaa gaa for someone. It displayed weakness in a normaly strong person. Which is exactly what jet wanted I supose. It also displayed weakness in Aang. It showed more of his jealous side. I wonder if someone will use this against him later on.
In my opinion, Jets actions were not justified but horribly selfish. To kill innocent citizens just so he can get to the real enemy is no way to do it. Jets smarter than that. He can probably come up with a better plan with less casualties.
You know how Katara said in this episode that shes never bended water she couldn't see? This isnt exactly true. She bended water out of Aangs lungs in The Warriors of Kyoshi. Maybe Im crazy but whatever, just though Id point that out.
One more thing. Is it just me or does Nickelodeon play this episode more that others? I probably watched it 6 times and yet Ive only see The Blue Spirit once.
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Darmani
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« Reply #28 on: Aug 14, 2006 12:38 am »

Thing is we DO attack centers where civilian casualties are inevitable.  the problem was that wasn't some military asset.  It was a fire nation village and that is why Jet was targetting it.  That is messed up.  He just wanted to hit fire nation whether they were camped out soldiers or a lone elderly man and he he'd go to any lengths to justify or do it.  He even robbed the dude. And if sokka wasn't there would have likely have done worse.  I know they need some ways of funding themselves but there has to be something better than rolling old folks.

Of course Jet's set up is such that his acts will become inevitable as he has no structure for resources, etc for the big score.  you'll also note he used the Gaang as a distraction and timed his attack for maximum impressive rescue.

I think the real issue though is that Jet won't even allow the possibility of being contradicted.  He surrounds himself with orphans and disgruntled types.  Preys on their needs and losses, compartmentalizes info and in short runs a cult.  If he were *that* eager to do his duty he'd join up with someone else or the army.  He's running a cult, at the very least of personality and he's dangerous and messed up.
« Last Edit: Aug 14, 2006 12:41 am by Darmani » Logged

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« Reply #29 on: Aug 14, 2006 06:48 am »

At certain times a terrorist is more effective than a soldier. Jet wishes the FN to fear remaining in the EK and his methods achieve that goal. On the battlefield the FN has clearly shown it's superiority so the other nations must find other ways to strike back.
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SessKo
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« Reply #30 on: Aug 14, 2006 10:20 am »

At certain times a terrorist is more effective than a soldier. Jet wishes the FN to fear remaining in the EK and his methods achieve that goal. On the battlefield the FN has clearly shown it's superiority so the other nations must find other ways to strike back.

Perhaps, but drowning civilians just to give them a scare is hardly justified.
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« Reply #31 on: Aug 14, 2006 09:24 pm »

Such is the unjust acts of war, etc.  Hate to admit, but stuff like that happens.  Public displays of executions, etc.  They do it to get their point across, whatever that may be.

This is one of my favorite eps.  The depth of the story is amazing.
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« Reply #32 on: Aug 16, 2006 05:20 am »

If Jet wanted to get those Fire Nation soldiers out of the village, he should have marched his band to the village and attacked the soldiers head on and got the civillians out. To me, it seemed he was just out for revenge and he would attack anyone. Like someone else said, if he truley wished to defeat the Fire Nation, he should have joined either an Earthbending army or a Waterbending army.

He was paranoid also, thinking that every person from the Fire Nation was going to assassinate him. Remember when he collected the poisoned dagger from the old man from the Fire Nation? How did he know the old man was going/not going to kill him? He could've simply had the poisoned dagger for self-defense in case a bear or another wild animal attacked, or Jet himself might have filled the dagger with the poison and said the "The old guy was going to assassinate me." story. If the old guy were really going to assassinate Jet, why didn't he get up and attempt to do so while Jet was blabbering about how the Fire Nation never showed any mercy. Well, you certianly didn't, Jet. You were screaming and threatning to harm a civillian. You acted just like a Firebending Soldier.

So you got this paranoid kid who's out for revenge and is attacking everyone in plain sight and he hangs out with disgrunted kids. I don't think Jet is really right in the head.

I forgot, when Sokka went down to the village, what happened to the Fire Nation soldiers?
« Last Edit: Aug 16, 2006 05:21 am by AvatarFan33 » Logged
Om
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« Reply #33 on: Aug 16, 2006 06:02 am »

If he'd marched into the village he would have been handily defeated so far as we've seen all Jet's attacks have been ambushes. He wouldn't be a match for FN weaponry and tactics head on.

Some people say the dagger was Jet's rather than the old man's but some people will say anything.

The old man may or may not have wanted to assasinate him but assuming he did he still retains some intelligence and wouldn't make a move when he's significantly outnumbered.

As I said before Jet's tactics can achieve results the army can't.

Finally the villagers were themselves FN who had settled in said village.
« Last Edit: Aug 16, 2006 06:16 am by Om » Logged

AvatarFan33
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« Reply #34 on: Aug 16, 2006 06:45 am »

Oh! I didn't know that. I just assumed that FN soldiers had settled in an Earthbending village. I guess i wasn't paying attention to what the characters were saying.  Tongue
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Darmani
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« Reply #35 on: Aug 17, 2006 01:52 pm »

Some people say the dagger was Jet's rather than the old man's but some people will say anything.


Okay we see the curved dagger before the old man.  ALSO Sokka notes he saw no knife.

That *is* an assassin's weapon or at least not standard self defense issue (if you can't swing something like a cudgel, a knife that my knick and kill you isn't a good idea).   

I am curious why you feel you can/should trust Jet on that dagger.  Not only was his claim rather off even not taking into account the man's apparent infirmity but if he honestly suspected the man was an assasin (not possible seeing the attack play out) why would he go *to* him as to... follow him back to his hideout and learn who's sending the attacks!  That was a mugging/assault. 

Actually just what are your whole feelings on Jet.
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« Reply #36 on: Aug 17, 2006 03:16 pm »

My feelings of Jet? Well, the only time i was happy to see Jet...



I read somewhere that Jet meets Zuko later in Season 2. My questions are:

1. How did Jet get from his ice coffin?

2. How did Jet not die of hypothermia? I mean, the ice was pratically covering his entire body!
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Darmani
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« Reply #37 on: Aug 17, 2006 04:57 pm »

If it didn't melt after katara left the environment was such I wouldn't be surprised he's okay.  Plus he had on clothing.  could be some nerve damage but he could get out of there just not on a timescale to battle the Gaang.
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« Reply #38 on: Aug 17, 2006 05:33 pm »

Or maybe, since i can't imagine his goons chisling him out of there (They might accidently cut him) or using a torch on him (They might accidently burn him), some Firebending soldiers came by:

FB Soldier: What happen to you?

Jet: Katara (or the Waterbending girl, if he didn't know her name) did this to me. If you let me go, i'll let you in on a secret on where the Avatar is!

(After much discussions, they release him)

 Yes, i know, it goes against the fact that Jet hated the FN, but if he wanted revenge on the "traitors", he'd probably do that very thing.

Maybe i don't know much about hypothermia, but i'll bet that the next time we see him, he'll be acting like he was never put in an ice cocoon before!

I doubt Jet just hung there and waited for the sun to melt his prison, nor do i think his goons helped him because they probably don't know where he is or they don't have the tools to release him. My bet is that he joins the FN army.
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Om
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« Reply #39 on: Aug 18, 2006 02:24 am »

Some people say the dagger was Jet's rather than the old man's but some people will say anything.


Okay we see the curved dagger before the old man.  ALSO Sokka notes he saw no knife.

That *is* an assassin's weapon or at least not standard self defense issue (if you can't swing something like a cudgel, a knife that my knick and kill you isn't a good idea).  

I am curious why you feel you can/should trust Jet on that dagger.  Not only was his claim rather off even not taking into account the man's apparent infirmity but if he honestly suspected the man was an assasin (not possible seeing the attack play out) why would he go *to* him as to... follow him back to his hideout and learn who's sending the attacks!  That was a mugging/assault. 

Actually just what are your whole feelings on Jet.

I was actually joking about the knife clearly Jet just used it to justify his assault on the old man. As for my feelings on Jet, I reckon he is a product of the war and in some ways necessary to the war effort. Outside of wartimes he's be considered a madman and a murderer but wartime is not peacetime. Other than that I find him an intriguing character and I don't generally accept whatever I'm told i.e the conclusion by the gaang that Jet's bad. Misguided? Perhaps. Overzealous? Maybe. Bad? I don't think so.

If somebody invaded my homeland, subjugated my people and then killed my parents I wouldn't be very likely to show them any mercy either.

Anyway all this is irrelevant if Jet was being honest in his comments to Iroh on the SotFN trailer wherein he states he is turning over a new leaf or words to that effect.
« Last Edit: Aug 18, 2006 03:43 am by Om » Logged

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« Reply #40 on: Aug 27, 2006 12:07 am »

I was very disapointed in Anng and Katara in the episode. When it first aired at the begining I was all, shame on them on them becuase they didn't trust Sokka and he's been with them what a year now? I mean come freakin on. Yah a total stranger comes up to you and says he's a better leader than your brother whom said he'd take care of you since day one, go trust that one why don't yah. I'm shocked Sokka didn't just leave Anng and Katara there, he could have after what they did to him, but Sokka has a pure heart I guess. I never liked Jet either, and I hope Sokka and him meet so Sokka can beat the crap out of him. Anng got to for some freakin reason, it should have been Sokka after what that jerk did to him <_<
            Any ways I was at least happy with how Sokka hanndled things, he was awesome this episode.
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« Reply #41 on: Aug 27, 2006 11:25 am »

If he'd marched into the village he would have been handily defeated so far as we've seen all Jet's attacks have been ambushes. He wouldn't be a match for FN weaponry and tactics head on.

Some people say the dagger was Jet's rather than the old man's but some people will say anything.

The old man may or may not have wanted to assasinate him but assuming he did he still retains some intelligence and wouldn't make a move when he's significantly outnumbered.

As I said before Jet's tactics can achieve results the army can't.

Finally the villagers were themselves FN who had settled in said village.
Precisely.  In war it does not matter how a result is achieved so long as your objective is.  If he can take out an entire regiment of Fire Nation soldiers with no loss to his assets as opposed to mounting a direct assault, he'd be a fool not to use the former option.

His destruction of the damn was underhanded to be sure.  I would consider his actions ethcially abhorrent as well.  However, he is facing a numerically and technologically superior enemy.  He and his forces would be routed in direct combat.  The only way for them to effectively mount a resistance is through terrorism and guerilla warfare.
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« Reply #42 on: Aug 27, 2006 11:44 am »

My feelings of Jet? Well, the only time i was happy to see Jet...
...

I read somewhere that Jet meets Zuko later in Season 2. My questions are:

1. How did Jet get from his ice coffin?

2. How did Jet not die of hypothermia? I mean, the ice was pratically covering his entire body!
1. Ice melts Smiley
2. It's avatar, anything can happen. Plus, ice melts. Smiley
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« Reply #43 on: Aug 27, 2006 12:48 pm »

My feelings of Jet? Well, the only time i was happy to see Jet...
...

I read somewhere that Jet meets Zuko later in Season 2. My questions are:

1. How did Jet get from his ice coffin?

2. How did Jet not die of hypothermia? I mean, the ice was pratically covering his entire body!
1. Ice melts Smiley
2. It's avatar, anything can happen. Plus, ice melts. Smiley

Plus, he could do the whistle thing to call his Freedom Fighters to get him out Tongue
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« Reply #44 on: Aug 27, 2006 12:50 pm »

(Imagines his FF chisling him out) LOL! I wonder if they are good chislers...
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« Reply #45 on: Aug 27, 2006 01:05 pm »

Well there's a big time gap between Jet being iced to the tree and where he meets Zuko. So I think it's safe to say if he did get sick from the cold, he's healthy now. I'm guessing his followers/friends/whatever did break him out. Jet probably led them to him via bird calling.
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« Reply #46 on: Aug 30, 2006 05:29 am »

Yeah. I just don't see how Jet's idea of: "Hey! Let's flood innocent villages all because they are FN!" is gonna help anyone. If he truely wishes to fight the FN, he needs to join an army. Yes, he and his little band would be slaughtered if they faced the FN soldiers head on, but that's why they need to join a EK or WT army instead of relentlessly attacking everyone in plain sight. The SotFN commerical of Jet showed me that he's still suspicious of everyone. [spoilers]Basically, in his warped mind, everyone that doesn't want to join his little group is a tratior and a follower of the FN.[/spoilers]

Y'know, i was thinking, what if Jet died in Ba-Sing-Se? Since he lied to Katara, maybe he can make it up to her by, perhaps, saving one of her friends or her from Azula? (Assuming Azula is going to the city as well)

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« Reply #47 on: Aug 30, 2006 10:52 am »

I was thinking the same thing about Jet before I saw the Jet preview on the ferry. It seems that all the 'changed men' in movies jump in the way of bullets to redeem themselves, I was expecting the same from Jet. (Just replace bullets with lightning.. Cheesy ) Now that we know he's still warped it just doesn't seem as logical. Why would he save people he believes to be traitors, even from the fire nation?

He may jump to strike Azula down and accidently get in the way of her firepower for someone, but I don't think he's going to save any gAang lives intentionally.
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« Reply #48 on: Aug 30, 2006 03:26 pm »

Good point. While it may seem touching and sad to have Jet laying down his life for Katara or someone else, he just won't do it. Unless, somehow for some strange reason, he suddenly changes a new leaf, we won't have Jet sacrificing himself for Katara or anyone.

Now, in most movies where the change character jumps in the way of the bullet, lightning, laser blast, whatever, they often have a change of heart right before they start running (Or jumping) in front of the hero. So maybe he might change his mind about the Gaang being "traitors" when he sees them battling Azula or someone from the FN. While i don't actually think the Avatar writers are gonna have that happen, it's a slim possibility. Remember, he thinks the Gaang are traitors, so what if he saw them fighting the FN (What he hates), will that change his perspective?
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« Reply #49 on: Aug 31, 2006 08:45 am »

There's a differance between (being upset that you don't want to join my merry band and later finding out that you're Fire Nation) and (thinking anyone who doesn't support me is a traitor and needs to die).

Flooding the village will help because the story of it will spread and the FN will fear the Freedom Fighter's and be wary of doing things that will bring down their wrath. It's called terrorism because it inspires terror and fear cripples your enemy.

The differance between a terrorist and a freedom fighter is not dependent on their methods or cause but on who is doing the labelling.

As for Jet sacrificing himself I don't see it happening unless he thinks he can do more for the EK by doing it than he can by staying alive or if he values said person more than himself. I don't see Jet valuing Katara or any of the gaang that much.
« Last Edit: Aug 31, 2006 09:00 am by Om » Logged

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